{"@context":"http://iiif.io/api/presentation/3/context.json","id":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/iiif/th8bg2kf54/manifest","type":"Manifest","label":{"en":["Oral History with Doria Hughes: In Memory of Rosemarie Beck"]},"logo":"https://d9jk7wjtjpu5g.cloudfront.net/organizations/logo_images/000/000/010/original/Aviary_QPLlogo_192x192.png?1578574261","metadata":[{"label":{"en":["Description"]},"value":{"en":["\u003cp\u003e\u003cstrong\u003eSummary of Full Interview\u003c/strong\u003e\u003c/p\u003e\r\n\u003cp\u003eDoria Hughes discusses the life of her grandmother Rosemarie Beck (1923-2003), a painter and a longtime art professor at Queens College. Doria describes her grandmother's upbringing in New Rochelle, detailing the Hungarian Jewish ancestry of Rosemarie's family and their passion for art, music, and literature. Doria explains that her grandmother loved classical music at a young age and was active in theater during high school, but Rosemarie's focus shifted to art history while attending Oberlin College, graduating with a Bachelor's degree in art history in 1944. Doria describes her grandmother's subsequent education and training as an artist, friendships with and guidance received from other artists, and difficulties earning money as an artist. Rosemarie married author Robert Phelps in 1945; they had one son and lived in Woodstock before moving to Manhattan in the mid-1960s.\u003c/p\u003e\r\n\u003cp\u003e \u003c/p\u003e\r\n\u003cp\u003eDoria details her grandmother's career teaching painting and drawing in various higher education institutions, noting that Rosemarie's time teaching at Queens College (1968 to 1991) coincided with Rosemarie's greatest period of productivity as an artist. Doria discusses the evolution of her grandmother's painting style over time from abstract expressionism to figurative and narrative, plus Rosemarie's objective as a teacher to help students find their own voices as artists. Doria explains how her grandmother helped shape her own interest in folklore and career as a professional storyteller. Additionally, Doria speaks about the ongoing work of the Rosemarie Beck Foundation in promulgating Rosemarie's artwork, legacy, and values as an artist and a teacher.\u003c/p\u003e\r\n\u003cp\u003e \u003c/p\u003e\r\n\u003cp\u003ePhoto: Rosemarie Beck, early 1970s. Courtesy of Doria Hughes.\u003c/p\u003e"]}},{"label":{"en":["Language"]},"value":{"en":["English"]}},{"label":{"en":["Coverage"]},"value":{"en":["1920s-2025 (temporal)","Queens College, Queens, NY; Manhattan, NY; Woodstock, NY; New Rochelle, NY; Oberlin, OH; Boston, MA (spatial)"]}},{"label":{"en":["Date"]},"value":{"en":["2025-04-24 (created)"]}},{"label":{"en":["Agent"]},"value":{"en":["Doria Hughes (Interviewee)","Rebecca Rushfield (Interviewer)"]}},{"label":{"en":["Rights Statement"]},"value":{"en":["\u003cp\u003eCC BY-NC-SA Contact digitalarchives@queenslibrary.org for research and reproduction requests.\u003c/p\u003e"]}},{"label":{"en":["Type"]},"value":{"en":["Video"]}},{"label":{"en":["Source Metadata URI"]},"value":{"en":["http://digitalarchives.queenslibrary.org/search/browse/45483"]}}],"summary":{"en":["\u003cp\u003e\u003cstrong\u003eSummary of Full Interview\u003c/strong\u003e\u003c/p\u003e\r\n\u003cp\u003eDoria Hughes discusses the life of her grandmother Rosemarie Beck (1923-2003), a painter and a longtime art professor at Queens College. Doria describes her grandmother's upbringing in New Rochelle, detailing the Hungarian Jewish ancestry of Rosemarie's family and their passion for art, music, and literature. Doria explains that her grandmother loved classical music at a young age and was active in theater during high school, but Rosemarie's focus shifted to art history while attending Oberlin College, graduating with a Bachelor's degree in art history in 1944. Doria describes her grandmother's subsequent education and training as an artist, friendships with and guidance received from other artists, and difficulties earning money as an artist. Rosemarie married author Robert Phelps in 1945; they had one son and lived in Woodstock before moving to Manhattan in the mid-1960s.\u003c/p\u003e\r\n\u003cp\u003e\u0026nbsp;\u003c/p\u003e\r\n\u003cp\u003eDoria details her grandmother's career teaching painting and drawing in various higher education institutions, noting that Rosemarie's time teaching at Queens College (1968 to 1991) coincided with Rosemarie's greatest period of productivity as an artist. Doria discusses the evolution of her grandmother's painting style over time from abstract expressionism to figurative and narrative, plus Rosemarie's objective as a teacher to help students find their own voices as artists. Doria explains how her grandmother helped shape her own interest in folklore and career as a professional storyteller. Additionally, Doria speaks about the ongoing work of the Rosemarie Beck Foundation in promulgating Rosemarie's artwork, legacy, and values as an artist and a teacher.\u003c/p\u003e\r\n\u003cp\u003e\u0026nbsp;\u003c/p\u003e\r\n\u003cp\u003ePhoto: Rosemarie Beck, early 1970s. Courtesy of Doria Hughes.\u003c/p\u003e"]},"requiredStatement":{"label":{"en":["Attribution"]},"value":{"en":["\u003cp\u003eCC BY-NC-SA Contact digitalarchives@queenslibrary.org for research and reproduction requests.\u003c/p\u003e"]}},"provider":[{"id":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/aboutus","type":"Agent","label":{"en":["Queens Public Library"]},"homepage":[{"id":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/","type":"Text","label":{"en":["Queens Public Library"]},"format":"text/html"}],"logo":[{"id":"https://d9jk7wjtjpu5g.cloudfront.net/organizations/logo_images/000/000/010/original/Aviary_QPLlogo_192x192.png?1578574261","type":"Image"}]}],"thumbnail":[{"id":"https://d9jk7wjtjpu5g.cloudfront.net/collection_resource_files/thumbnails/000/290/267/small/hughes_doria_20250424_portrait_resized.jpg?1756905357","type":"Image","format":"image/jpeg"}],"items":[{"id":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267","type":"Canvas","label":{"en":["Media File 1 of 1 - hughes_doria_20250424_full.mp4"]},"duration":4216.992,"width":640,"height":360,"thumbnail":[{"id":"https://d9jk7wjtjpu5g.cloudfront.net/collection_resource_files/thumbnails/000/290/267/small/hughes_doria_20250424_portrait_resized.jpg?1756905357","type":"Image","format":"image/jpeg"}],"items":[{"id":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267/content/1","type":"AnnotationPage","items":[{"id":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267/content/1/annotation/1","type":"Annotation","motivation":"painting","body":{"id":"https://aviary-p-queenslibrary.s3.wasabisys.com/collection_resource_files/resource_files/000/290/267/original/hughes_doria_20250424_full.mp4?1756904975","type":"Video","format":"video/mp4","duration":4216.992,"width":640,"height":360},"target":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267","metadata":[]}]}],"annotations":[{"id":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267/transcript/83654","type":"AnnotationPage","label":{"en":["Full Transcript [Transcript]"]},"items":[{"id":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267/transcript/83654/annotation/1","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Rebecca Rushfield: Bye-bye. OK, I'll do, setting the date. OK. It is Thursday, April 24th, 2025. It's about 1:30 in the afternoon Eastern time. I'm Rebecca Rushfield. I'm interviewing Doria Hughes about her grandmother, Rosemarie Beck, who was a professor at Queens College for many years. So, you also are the head of the foundation that handles your grandmother's work?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267#t=0.0,37.0"},{"id":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267/transcript/83654/annotation/2","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Doria Hughes: I'm the managing director. So, in partnership with the board of trustees -- we sort of co-run. It's a very non-corporate situation, but I am sort of the face of the organization and the managing director and also the archivist and also the collection manager. I wear many hats.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267#t=37.0,63.0"},{"id":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267/transcript/83654/annotation/3","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Rebecca Rushfield: Right. And are you the only family member involved in the...","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267#t=63.0,69.0"},{"id":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267/transcript/83654/annotation/4","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Doria Hughes: Actually, no. My father, Dr. Roger Phelps, is on the board as the president -- although we sort of rotate those positions. And he co-founded the Rosemarie Beck Foundation with my grandmother in her last year of life.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267#t=69.0,89.0"},{"id":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267/transcript/83654/annotation/5","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Rebecca Rushfield: Oh. So she was preparing. That was very wise of her.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267#t=89.0,93.0"},{"id":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267/transcript/83654/annotation/6","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Doria Hughes: Yes. And that was something that had been on her mind for some time. And I know she had talked to him about this and she talked to me to a certain extent as well in the years before. She was thinking ahead.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267#t=93.0,108.0"},{"id":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267/transcript/83654/annotation/7","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Rebecca Rushfield: Right. So can I ask, and then we'll get to her life, but does the foundation sort of try to place her works now in museums and collections?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267#t=108.0,115.0"},{"id":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267/transcript/83654/annotation/8","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Doria Hughes: Yes.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267#t=115.0,115.0"},{"id":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267/transcript/83654/annotation/9","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Rebecca Rushfield: So theoretically one day the foundation will go out of business because...","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267#t=115.0,123.0"},{"id":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267/transcript/83654/annotation/10","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Doria Hughes: Yes, that is actually, that is sort of the dream. That's very much core, our core mission is to promulgate her work and her legacy and just help get out word about her and her art, but also just her, what we think of as her values, what she believed in as an artist and as a teacher. 'Cause those two things were both so very core to who she was as a person. And, yeah, so we're not -- our goal is not to hoard art, but to really share knowledge and information and get the art placed as well as we can for maximum access by the public.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267#t=123.0,176.0"},{"id":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267/transcript/83654/annotation/11","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Rebecca Rushfield: Can I ask, how well did you know your grandmother growing up? And if I can ask, about how old were you when she died? You were an adult?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267#t=176.0,183.0"},{"id":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267/transcript/83654/annotation/12","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Doria Hughes: Yes, I was, let's see, it was 2003. Was I about 30 then? I don't know...","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267#t=183.0,191.0"},{"id":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267/transcript/83654/annotation/13","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Rebecca Rushfield: You were a grownup.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267#t=191.0,192.0"},{"id":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267/transcript/83654/annotation/14","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Doria Hughes: Yeah, I was 29. And a young mother at the time. Those last five months of her life were very intense. And myself and my father and a number of her former students, actually former Queens students, were intimately involved with her care and also the setting up of the Rosemarie Beck Foundation. Yeah.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267#t=192.0,225.0"},{"id":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267/transcript/83654/annotation/15","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Rebecca Rushfield: How often did you see your grandmother growing up? What was your interaction with her?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267#t=225.0,232.0"},{"id":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267/transcript/83654/annotation/16","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Doria Hughes: Yes. Well, growing up I was her only grandchild, which I felt to be an immense privilege. I was and still am extremely proud to be her granddaughter. She only had one child, my father. And my impression always was that she just adored us. And we didn't see, I never saw her as much as I would've liked. Of course, I grew up in the Boston area and she was a New Yorker. And I just remember, once a year my father and I would get on a Greyhound bus and go to New York. And for me, I've always sort of thought of it as like a return to the old country. For me, New York City is the old country. That's sort of the land of my ancestors.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267#t=232.0,283.0"},{"id":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267/transcript/83654/annotation/17","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Rebecca Rushfield: Right.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267#t=283.0,284.0"},{"id":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267/transcript/83654/annotation/18","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Doria Hughes: And so it's always this return or homecoming feeling.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267#t=284.0,288.0"},{"id":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267/transcript/83654/annotation/19","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Rebecca Rushfield: Although she wasn't born in New York City.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267#t=288.0,291.0"},{"id":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267/transcript/83654/annotation/20","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Doria Hughes: No, she always says she was born in Westchester, which -- it's New Rochelle. Which is where she grew up, but she was always oriented to New York City, and she was constantly taking buses there from wherever she was. And she raised my father for his first years in Woodstock. And she lived in Woodstock for many years. She and my grandfather. And my great-grandmother -- who was her mother -- lived in Woodstock until she passed. And I remember also going to visit my Oma in Woodstock with my father, and I loved that as well.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267#t=291.0,327.0"},{"id":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267/transcript/83654/annotation/21","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Rebecca Rushfield: Can I ask something? Because in certain ways, knowledge of her is eclipsed by knowledge of her brother.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267#t=327.0,335.0"},{"id":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267/transcript/83654/annotation/22","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Doria Hughes: Oh, yes, Jimmy. Yes.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267#t=335.0,341.0"},{"id":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267/transcript/83654/annotation/23","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Rebecca Rushfield: But they got along well, or...?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267#t=341.0,344.0"},{"id":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267/transcript/83654/annotation/24","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Doria Hughes: Yes. Yeah. The two of them, I think, were quite close. And I remember Jimmy said of her, he said, \"She was my first teacher.\" Which, that really struck me. I found that remarkable, because of course he was a teacher. They were so, they were very alike, I thought, in many, many ways, even though there was a decent amount of years between them. But they had such similarity of temperament. Of course, upbringing. But I think also, for lack of a better word, values. They were both incredibly passionate about art. And they had...","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267#t=344.0,388.0"},{"id":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267/transcript/83654/annotation/25","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Rebecca Rushfield: Were their parents passionate about art?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267#t=388.0,391.0"},{"id":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267/transcript/83654/annotation/26","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Doria Hughes: Yes, I think it was really a family value. And my father describes this because he knew his grandparents and actually his great-grandfather very, very well from the Woodstock days. They all pretty much lived together. So my father's great-grandfather was a Hungarian Jewish man who was a lawyer by training and apparently was very highly educated and spoke -- I was told that he spoke eight languages. That might've been an exaggeration.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267#t=391.0,435.0"},{"id":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267/transcript/83654/annotation/27","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Rebecca Rushfield: Well, you know a few words of one language, that counts, a few...","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267#t=435.0,439.0"},{"id":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267/transcript/83654/annotation/28","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Doria Hughes: Yeah. Well, he was a subject of the Austro-Hungarian Empire. I have some pictures of him. And he raised his family there. And then his oldest daughter, my Oma, immigrated with her husband, Sam Beck, to New York in like 1921 or so. And they were very excited to be Americans, but they also retained close ties with their families in Hungary. And they were part of a large extended network family, the Weisz family. W-E-I-S-Z. They were a very affluent, by all reports an affluent and cultured family of Hungarian Jews.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267#t=439.0,493.0"},{"id":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267/transcript/83654/annotation/29","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Rebecca Rushfield: So she came by her interest in art and culture...","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267#t=493.0,496.0"},{"id":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267/transcript/83654/annotation/30","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Doria Hughes: Yes. Her father's great dream for her -- for his oldest daughter, Rosemarie -- his great dream was for her to be a concert violinist. And he took her to concerts. Apparently, after the Depression hit, they lost pretty much everything they had. And so they went from being a family of aspirational new Americans to being just a working-class family who are just making do. But they retained this sense of heritage, of culture, and of the significance of music, art, literature. All of these things. So that was the household in which my grandmother and her younger siblings were raised. And there was a sister, Antoinette, who became a choreographer and dancer and a very cultured person in her own right. Yeah.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267#t=496.0,556.0"},{"id":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267/transcript/83654/annotation/31","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Rebecca Rushfield: So, did your grandmother enjoy -- enjoy is not the right word. Did she share her father's dreams for her of being...?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267#t=556.0,567.0"},{"id":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267/transcript/83654/annotation/32","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Doria Hughes: Yes, to a certain extent. She retained a lifelong, absolute worship, I would say, of classical music. Which was passed down to my father and to myself. I'm actually married to a composer. Growing up, classical music was always very, very important in my family. And actually my father married...my mother is a classical musician, classically trained. A teacher. Runs a music series. So I've always been aware that music is very, very important as a family value.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267#t=567.0,606.0"},{"id":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267/transcript/83654/annotation/33","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Doria Hughes: And my grandmother was sent to Oberlin Conservatory in around 1939 or 1940. I actually contacted them some years ago and found her acceptance letter. So she was sent there at the very beginning of World War II. To be -- to rural Ohio, to this very highly regarded conservatory. And in her own words, she went and she attended and she dutifully practiced. But, across the square from the conservatory at Oberlin is a museum called the Allen Memorial Art Museum. And she went there and she started taking art history classes. And she said early one morning she was being shown slides of art and a slide came up of a Rembrandt etching. And she said that changed everything for her. And she ended up transferring out of the conservatory to the college, where she became an art history major.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267#t=606.0,672.0"},{"id":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267/transcript/83654/annotation/34","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Rebecca Rushfield: Do you know, as a child or a young adult, did she paint at all? Or this was all...?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267#t=672.0,679.0"},{"id":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267/transcript/83654/annotation/35","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Doria Hughes: Yes. She went to, she attended a public high school in New Rochelle that happened to have, they had a very good music department. They also had a very good theater department, according to her. Now, this was her other great love. And anyone who knew my grandmother knows that she was an incredibly theatrical person and she had a great love of literature and theater and was very dramatic in all of her movements and her voice and everything. I remember this quite vividly about her. What I didn't know until after she died was that she was a very active participant in the drama department at her high school and at Oberlin College. And in fact, in the drama department of her high school, she was given free reign to paint the theater sets.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267#t=679.0,734.0"},{"id":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267/transcript/83654/annotation/36","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Rebecca Rushfield: OK, got it.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267#t=734.0,735.0"},{"id":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267/transcript/83654/annotation/37","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Doria Hughes: And that was really the beginning for her. And she described just -- they just basically said, \"Here, do whatever you want.\" And they would just say, we need a set for such and such a play. And she would just start painting. She also, in college, she continued doing that, but she also was head, apparently, of the makeup department at a student-run theatrical department. And so she would paint people's faces as well as paint the sets. And periodically she would also be called in to act in different productions. So that was a big, I think that was immensely important to her beginning.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267#t=735.0,772.0"},{"id":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267/transcript/83654/annotation/38","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Rebecca Rushfield: Are there any photos that you have of the sceneries?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267#t=772.0,776.0"},{"id":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267/transcript/83654/annotation/39","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Doria Hughes: Not of the scenery, but I have a picture of her dressed up for a play. She's making this face and she's in this thing, and she's very -- she was a very tall woman, and she had a very striking presence. And she would fling her arms around and use her voice and all. And so having learned all this, it all makes sense.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267#t=776.0,799.0"},{"id":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267/transcript/83654/annotation/40","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Rebecca Rushfield: Right. So she transferred and decided she was studying art history?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267#t=799.0,803.0"},{"id":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267/transcript/83654/annotation/41","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Doria Hughes: Yes. And she was doing theater. And she still continued to play her violin, and actually she played violin through much of her adult life and even performed occasionally -- mostly on an amateur level. But just adored classical music and playing in string quartets. And music recurs quite a bit in a lot of her art.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267#t=803.0,825.0"},{"id":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267/transcript/83654/annotation/42","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Rebecca Rushfield: So after she graduated from Oberlin, what was she hoping to do?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267#t=825.0,832.0"},{"id":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267/transcript/83654/annotation/43","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Doria Hughes: Well, I think like many new graduates from college, she was floundering a little bit. And keep in mind that she graduated right at the end of World War II, so her college career very much followed the trajectory of the war. Oberlin is actually where she also met her husband, her future husband. My grandfather.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267#t=832.0,854.0"},{"id":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267/transcript/83654/annotation/44","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Rebecca Rushfield: Did she ever talk about what it was like to be in Oberlin? I was in Oberlin once applying for a job, and I realized I could not be out there as this New Yorker used to...so what was it like? I mean, back then, I'm sure she didn't have her own car there. It's pretty far from everything. You're isolated. I guess it's wonderful if you want to throw yourself into your studies, but...","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267#t=854.0,877.0"},{"id":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267/transcript/83654/annotation/45","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Doria Hughes: Yes.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267#t=877.0,878.0"},{"id":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267/transcript/83654/annotation/46","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Rebecca Rushfield: What was it like for someone who was coming down to New York to see things and do, to be in such an isolated place?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267#t=878.0,887.0"},{"id":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267/transcript/83654/annotation/47","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Doria Hughes: Well, the thing about Oberlin, and I say this -- I'm an Oberlin graduate myself, so I know the place quite well. And I'm a scholar and a bookworm, and I'll call it what it is: I'm a nerd. And so Oberlin is very, very good for people like that. And so sometimes I puzzled a little bit about that, but my grandmother, in addition to being very dramatic and being a very talented artist, was also quite erudite in her way. And I think she picked up scholarly habits and discipline there that really stayed with her for life. I'm actually reading a book of hers from her private library. A book on Matisse that she purchased for herself as a Christmas present in 1999. And I'm going through this book of Matisse and I can see that she had a pencil and she was going through and underlining, and making little checks and notes, and then she wrote about it in her journal.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267#t=887.0,946.0"},{"id":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267/transcript/83654/annotation/48","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Doria Hughes: So I think these habits, these scholarly habits of discipline, were very much impressed upon her, and she was receptive to that at Oberlin. The other thing is, and this has to do with World War II, my grandmother had the great good fortune of benefiting from certain very significant scholarly people and some of the great minds in the field of art history who, like her grandparents, fled the Nazis for America. And one of these people at Oberlin was a man called Stechow, S-T-E-C-H-O-W. I'm blanking on his first name [note: it is Wolfgang]. But apparently he was a German Jewish scholar in the field of art history. And he fled the Nazis and ended up in Ohio teaching art history to American kids during the war. And one of them happened to be my grandmother. So she received a very, very solid education and habits of learning there. And so as much as she was an artist and very immersed in the bohemian artistic life of the 1950s and on in New York, she had this background of scholarship that really formed her. And then later when she came back to New York for a brief time, she studied with Erwin Panofsky, who was a member of the Hamburg Art History School, who really kind of helped to form the field of art history. She studied with him at New York University very briefly.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267#t=946.0,1050.0"},{"id":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267/transcript/83654/annotation/49","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Rebecca Rushfield: She went to New York, NYU. Was she planning on becoming an art historian or...?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267#t=1050.0,1056.0"},{"id":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267/transcript/83654/annotation/50","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Doria Hughes: Yeah, I think she was. I think coming from Oberlin and getting that kind of a background in education, then showing up -- she was like 22 -- in New York and thinking, what do I do? I need to do something. I think she just kind of continued on without a break and just kept doing what she was doing. Which was art history. But, at the same time, she was also going to the Met and bringing her sketchbook and sketching. Sketching with her was almost pathological. She was constantly creating art. If she wasn't in the studio painting, then she...If she wasn't in her studio teaching, she was just... She would have these little sketchbooks of all different sizes. She would pull one out of her pocket when she was on the subway commuting. She'd lift her sketchbook out and just sketching. Or, she would be at the dinner table, she'd be stitching. In faculty meetings she would pull her sketchbook out and start sketching the people around her. It never stopped with her. So, for all that she was very engaged with scholarly pursuits in her early 20s, the art-making was so essential and needful to her. It was continual. And I think it got to a point where she just couldn't, she couldn't stop. She couldn't resist, and she felt pulled and compelled. And she followed that.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267#t=1056.0,1157.0"},{"id":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267/transcript/83654/annotation/51","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Rebecca Rushfield: Your uncle, the art historian, did he have a creative, artistic bent too? Or he was not...?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267#t=1157.0,1165.0"},{"id":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267/transcript/83654/annotation/52","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Doria Hughes: Yes. My understanding is that he did do some painting in his early years. Enough to understand the basics of how it worked.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267#t=1165.0,1176.0"},{"id":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267/transcript/83654/annotation/53","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Rebecca Rushfield: He didn't have her passion.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267#t=1176.0,1179.0"},{"id":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267/transcript/83654/annotation/54","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Doria Hughes: No. That family had one artist.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267#t=1179.0,1183.0"},{"id":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267/transcript/83654/annotation/55","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Rebecca Rushfield: OK, so she left NYU. She realized she wasn't going to be an art historian. What did she do then?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267#t=1183.0,1191.0"},{"id":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267/transcript/83654/annotation/56","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Doria Hughes: Well, she was also taking classes at the Art Students League, although she resisted some of the instruction. And then she did a lot of different odd jobs. So she was, her home base was at her family place in New Rochelle. They were still in New Rochelle. So she was commuting in by bus or getting lifts from her father, who worked at a liquor store to support the family. And so she would get into the city, and so she...She also, what I discovered was, she worked for a man called George Amberg at the Museum of Modern Art, where there was a dance department at this time. And George Amberg was curating shows relating to dance at MoMA, and did some publications. And she was his research assistant.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267#t=1191.0,1248.0"},{"id":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267/transcript/83654/annotation/57","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Rebecca Rushfield: Could we stop for one second?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267#t=1248.0,1250.0"},{"id":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267/transcript/83654/annotation/58","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Doria Hughes: Yes.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267#t=1250.0,1252.0"},{"id":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267/transcript/83654/annotation/59","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Rebecca Rushfield: So she was his research assistant.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267#t=1252.0,1254.0"},{"id":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267/transcript/83654/annotation/60","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Doria Hughes: Yes, so she was doing that. She also -- I don't know how she got this gig -- but she was, as she put it, a gofer for the artist Kurt Seligman, a Surrealist. And so she was running errands for him and somehow involved with things there. Although she said that she never quite felt simpatico with him in terms of art. I have some early sketches of hers from the '40s that show sort of Surrealist tendencies. So I think she tried it out. But...","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267#t=1254.0,1296.0"},{"id":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267/transcript/83654/annotation/61","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Rebecca Rushfield: Can I ask? At that point, when her parents were no longer affluent...","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267#t=1296.0,1300.0"},{"id":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267/transcript/83654/annotation/62","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Doria Hughes: Right.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267#t=1300.0,1300.0"},{"id":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267/transcript/83654/annotation/63","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Rebecca Rushfield: Were they concerned that she was going to, wanted to be an artist?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267#t=1300.0,1305.0"},{"id":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267/transcript/83654/annotation/64","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Doria Hughes: I think there was probably some concern. However, I also think that there may have been more opportunities -- or seeming at least -- with things like the Works Progress Administration. There was, I think there was a notion that there might be opportunities. The main issue was, though, that all of them knew that they had to work. And my grandmother from the get-go was hoofing it around and getting work. And I think she didn't have to be told once or twice by anybody that she had to make her way.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267#t=1305.0,1344.0"},{"id":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267/transcript/83654/annotation/65","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Doria Hughes: Her parents, I think, were always very proud of her gifts. I think they probably, at different points, were concerned. They had reason to worry about whether she'd be able to make it financially. I think it was a very parlous thing for a woman in the '40s to make her way in that field. But she had multiple jobs that she alludes to. So she was...and then she had a garden-level apartment with three other girls in the post-war era. She was being courted by my grandfather, who had taken a bus from Ohio to follow her. Essentially, he really wanted to be near her and with her family and part of that whole scene. And she was just trying to make money any way she possibly could. That's actually how the embroidery got started. Her mother, my Oma, taught her how to embroider, and then it was one of many little side gigs that she did, of embroidering shirts and selling them to people. So everything had to be monetized to some degree or another to make ends meet.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267#t=1344.0,1417.0"},{"id":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267/transcript/83654/annotation/66","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Rebecca Rushfield: And embroidery was something she did throughout her life?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267#t=1417.0,1420.0"},{"id":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267/transcript/83654/annotation/67","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Doria Hughes: Yes, yeah. But she was reticent about being known for doing that as an artist, because I think she felt that as a woman, that was going to make people... She was very worried that people wouldn't take her seriously if they thought she was just sewing. So that was a kind of a secret, almost a secretive activity. It was something she did in the evenings at home. She didn't...and it was artistically, now we can see, very much connected with her art practice. But she wasn't really showing her embroideries actively with her painting. She was...well, finally she met Robert Motherwell and he became really her first major teacher, I would say. Well, actually, she knew [Philip] Guston around that time also. And so she got into Abstract Expressionism.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267#t=1420.0,1484.0"},{"id":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267/transcript/83654/annotation/68","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Rebecca Rushfield: Did she -- I mean, that's before you were born, all of this. But did she ever talk about what it was like to be a woman in this very male, macho environment?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267#t=1484.0,1497.0"},{"id":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267/transcript/83654/annotation/69","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Doria Hughes: Yes. She said whenever she would get together with the other men for potlucks and such, it was always her who would make a casserole or whatever, and that sort of thing. I mean, she was pretty fearless and would just go, she would go to places like the Cedar Bar and hang out. And I think...But she was very also leery of being labeled as a \"lady painteress\" -- her words. So she was just, \"I'm an artist.\" That was always sort of her thing. So I think I see her as a bit of a proto-feminist, but I don't know if she would've used that terminology for herself.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267#t=1497.0,1547.0"},{"id":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267/transcript/83654/annotation/70","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Rebecca Rushfield: Was she friendly with the other women who were sort of around, on the edges of that?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267#t=1547.0,1554.0"},{"id":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267/transcript/83654/annotation/71","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Doria Hughes: To a certain extent, although I think she would've been worried again about being sort of grouped or categorized. So actually most of her really close friends, the people she called her confreres or her brothers were men. One of her closest friends was Paul Resika, who's still living. He was a bit younger, but she said of him many times, Resika is my brother. So, yeah.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267#t=1554.0,1591.0"},{"id":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267/transcript/83654/annotation/72","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Rebecca Rushfield: So at what point did she get into teaching? Was that early on in her career?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267#t=1591.0,1599.0"},{"id":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267/transcript/83654/annotation/73","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Doria Hughes: Yes. Yes. And actually Motherwell suggested it to her, because he saw from early on A) that she was gifted, and B) that it was going to be a struggle and she was going to need to be able to make her way, and teaching makes sense. And so he may have even helped her to get some teaching gigs. I know he helped her to get the notice of different gallerists, like the Stable Gallery. I think he helped make that happen. A couple of shows at the Whitney. They acquired one of her early abstract pieces, and then I believe her very first teaching gig was at Vassar. And then soon after Middlebury College.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267#t=1599.0,1646.0"},{"id":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267/transcript/83654/annotation/74","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Rebecca Rushfield: At that point, she was living in...Woodstock?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267#t=1646.0,1649.0"},{"id":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267/transcript/83654/annotation/75","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Doria Hughes: Woodstock. Yes. Yeah. She and Robert married in 1945. And initially they were just living with her parents. They were in this house in New Rochelle. Her parents were there. She had two younger siblings who I think at that point were at Oberlin. They went to Oberlin as well. And then her grandparents were also there. So her parents, her grandparents, herself, her husband, and then eventually her infant son. I found the census record for 1949. Whoa! This is a crowded house! But eventually they did decamp to Woodstock.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267#t=1649.0,1697.0"},{"id":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267/transcript/83654/annotation/76","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Rebecca Rushfield: Now, Woodstock then was an artist place? Or not yet?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267#t=1697.0,1701.0"},{"id":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267/transcript/83654/annotation/77","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Doria Hughes: Yes, yes, very much so. And I know Woodstock has been through various iterations, but it always had a draw, I think, for artists. And at different points, she hosted teaching sessions and classes actually in her home. One of my father's earliest memories -- I've sort of reconstructed this. I found a cache of drawings, of nudes of a rather distinctive-looking man that clearly dated, they were dated from the '50s. And I thought, \"That's interesting.\" Beause that was well within her Abstract Expressionist time. And she was commuting into the city and attending Robert Motherwell's atelier. He called it, he had what he called the Robert Motherwell School of Art, which was really just him giving lectures a couple of times a week out of his studio with Bradley Walker Tomlin, who was a very good friend of my grandparents at that time.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267#t=1701.0,1765.0"},{"id":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267/transcript/83654/annotation/78","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Doria Hughes: But, when she was home in Woodstock, they were always trying to make ends meet. She ran a little studio, an atelier of her own, out of her home in the evenings. And it was figurative. Basically what she did was she found a couple of neighbors of hers who were even poorer than she was and paid them to pose nude for class. And she would send her child and the child of the neighbors -- the kids would all be sent up to bed at night, and then they would have this session in the living room or whatever. And my father remembers as a very little boy sneaking down to peak and see what was going on. And he saw there was his neighbor stark naked and everybody was painting him. And then his mother caught him, \"Oh! Back to bed. Go back up to bed.\" So this was all...she was always trying to think of different ways to bring in income for the family. But it's also indicative of the fact that figurative work was a continual line. Regardless of whether she was trying a little Surrealism or...she was quite serious as an Abstract Expressionist. And yet, back in Woodstock, she was sort of leading a double life artistically. Which is interesting.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267#t=1765.0,1852.0"},{"id":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267/transcript/83654/annotation/79","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Rebecca Rushfield: Did she stay, teach long at Vassar? Or did...?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267#t=1852.0,1857.0"},{"id":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267/transcript/83654/annotation/80","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Doria Hughes: She was there for a few years, and I actually had the very good fortune to befriend one of her former students from that time who lives quite near me here in the Boston area. And has given me some insight there. So yeah, she taught at Vassar from around like '57 or '58 off and on until about 1961. And she had stints at Middlebury during that time and after. So kind of going back and forth and trying to figure this out. The objection to Middlebury, even though I think they paid better, was that it was, she had to live on campus up in Vermont. And that meant she had to leave her child. And her parents at first said, \"No, you can't leave your young child. He's too little. You can't do that.\" But, the household needed her income. And so finally it was agreed that she was going to go up to Middlebury and teach. And she left her son in the care of his father, her husband, but also primarily her parents. And my father remembers very, very well that he spent long stretches of time in his grandparents' home.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267#t=1857.0,1942.0"},{"id":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267/transcript/83654/annotation/81","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Rebecca Rushfield: Between Vassar and Middlebury and Queens did she --they moved. Did she and her family move back to New York, and that's why she kind of came to Queens? Or she was invited by Queens, and then they moved to follow?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267#t=1942.0,1961.0"},{"id":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267/transcript/83654/annotation/82","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Doria Hughes: So there were some interstitial steps. So by the 1960s, my grandparents really, really -- they wanted to move to New York. They were trying very hard to figure out, how do we do this? And they had a lot of friends there, and they would sometimes stay for short periods. But they were trying to figure out how to do this. And eventually they sent my father, who was a rather precocious, scholarly kid, they sent him to Andover. To boarding school in Massachusetts. And people who know my father wonder, how is it that a New York-born person is such an avid Red Sox fan? And so this is how it happened. So when he was about 13, they shipped him off to boarding school. And at that point, it was right around that time that they finally moved. They got an apartment.They sort of took over the lease, I think, of a mutual friend in Manhattan. Six East 12th Street. And they moved in there at around 1965 or so. There was a lot of backing and forthing and spending portions of time, and eventually they moved in full time.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267#t=1961.0,2048.0"},{"id":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267/transcript/83654/annotation/83","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Rebecca Rushfield: But I'm thinking back then you could still find cheap places in parts of Manhattan.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267#t=2048.0,2051.0"},{"id":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267/transcript/83654/annotation/84","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Doria Hughes: Yes. Yeah.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267#t=2051.0,2054.0"},{"id":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267/transcript/83654/annotation/85","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Rebecca Rushfield: In artist...","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267#t=2054.0,2060.0"},{"id":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267/transcript/83654/annotation/86","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Doria Hughes: Yeah. And they were delighted. And there was space. There was a studio portion and then their living space. And so that's what they did. And interestingly, her parents and widower grandfather stayed behind in Woodstock. They preferred to live there. My great-grandfather apparently was an avid gardener, and that was part of how he supported the family, was growing all their own vegetables. That's some of my father's earliest memories. My father's quite a gardener as well. So they stayed in Woodstock. And, to this day, my father does not consider himself a New Yorker. He doesn't have anything to do with the city. He was always a Woodstock boy. That's his hometown that he remembers from a child.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267#t=2060.0,2112.0"},{"id":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267/transcript/83654/annotation/87","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Rebecca Rushfield: I guess once she was back in the city, she could be more involved in the arts.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267#t=2112.0,2117.0"},{"id":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267/transcript/83654/annotation/88","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Doria Hughes: Yes. And teaching. And at that point, through some mutual friends, she got a teaching gig at Parsons. The New School. So that was, her main teaching gig during the 1960s was actually at Parsons. And that's where she met another good friend, Rackstraw Downes. He was teaching. He remembers -- I've chatted with him. He remembers teaching there. They were both teaching different classes of painting and drawing. And there was only a very thin partition that separated their studios, their teaching studios. And Rackstraw could remember, he could always hear her voice on the other side of the partition. And he was always concerned that she was going to kind of come on over and sort of get involved with his students. And so it was very difficult to achieve that separation. But yes, so she did teach for a while at Parsons, but Rackstraw says that he doesn't think that she was happy teaching there and that she really wanted to be in a proper art department. And she got different, I think, summer teaching stints here and there. And then eventually she landed the position at Queens, and that was like. That really did it.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267#t=2117.0,2212.0"},{"id":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267/transcript/83654/annotation/89","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Rebecca Rushfield: Well, I think at that time, at least before the city went broke, one got paid well at Queens.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267#t=2212.0,2222.0"},{"id":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267/transcript/83654/annotation/90","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Doria Hughes: I mean, for her, it's very clear that it was an absolute game changer. And once she started teaching there, which [was] more or less right around 1970-ish or so. And, as usual, it's so hard to find absolute beginnings of things. Everything bleeds over here and there, and she would get partial roles or summer things or this and that, and then finally she'd be like, OK, I'm on the faculty. But that basically, starting in the 1970s is when I think of when she started teaching. And that initiated probably her greatest period of productivity as an artist as well.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267#t=2222.0,2263.0"},{"id":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267/transcript/83654/annotation/91","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Rebecca Rushfield: She was stable and not worrying about...","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267#t=2263.0,2270.0"},{"id":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267/transcript/83654/annotation/92","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Doria Hughes: Yeah. That's when, in the 1970s, that's when she started working on her Orpheus cycle. And she just unleashed herself into that. The '60s was a lot of experimentation. Trying a little this and a little of that. In the mid-60s she had worked for a while in a series that she called The Lovers, and actually that was in conjunction with Resika. They split the cost of hiring two studio models and split the cost of the studio. And they were nude models, so they had to heat the studio as a whole. Everything with her was always like, \"Oh, the expense, how am I going to do this? Well, Resika split the cost. Great!\" So they created this body of work. But it wasn't really until around 1970 that she fully became herself as a narrative artist. Becuase she had been a figurative artist for a while and she knew that was where she was going, but it was really narrative. And to explore that and to really take -- she took five or six years to really fully explore that theme. She needed that kind of space and time, and to be able to really move into that. And I think the stability of a stable, of a serious teaching gig at that kind of a university and being part of a group of colleagues, serious-minded, all of that, I think that played a role.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267#t=2270.0,2362.0"},{"id":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267/transcript/83654/annotation/93","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Rebecca Rushfield: Do you know which courses she started teaching? Was it sort of drawing, painting?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267#t=2362.0,2371.0"},{"id":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267/transcript/83654/annotation/94","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Doria Hughes: I'll have to...you know what? I should look through some of the catalogs I have. But she often would teach drawing courses. I think those basics. Drawing was so important to her. She loved that. So yeah, she usually was drawing, painting. Sometimes there'd be eventually groups of graduate students. And she always talked about \"crits.\" That was very, very important. She took all of this really seriously.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267#t=2371.0,2401.0"},{"id":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267/transcript/83654/annotation/95","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Doria Hughes: I was actually just reading a letter to a former student of hers that she wrote, because she was...The other thing that was so important to her professionally or to her teaching -- rather to her painting -- is stints at Yaddo. And she sometimes would get a letter saying, OK, here's your Yaddo dates and from here to here. And the problem is that sometimes that would cut in right in a portion of the end of the semester, and then she'd go, \"Argh.\" And so sometimes she would miss the last day or so when students were presenting, and so she was writing this anxious letter to a student, \"Oh, I missed the last day. Their presentation. They had to present to so-and-so instead. Oh, no. Was it OK?\" Her students were really like her children in many ways. She was very protective and worried, wanted to make sure they were OK and all of that. Yeah.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267#t=2401.0,2462.0"},{"id":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267/transcript/83654/annotation/96","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Rebecca Rushfield: In terms of her colleagues at Queens, were there any she was very friendly with, or...?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267#t=2462.0,2468.0"},{"id":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267/transcript/83654/annotation/97","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Doria Hughes: Finkelstein. Louie. Louis or Louie?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267#t=2468.0,2472.0"},{"id":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267/transcript/83654/annotation/98","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Rebecca Rushfield: Louis Finkelstein, yes.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267#t=2472.0,2474.0"},{"id":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267/transcript/83654/annotation/99","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Doria Hughes: Was it -- is it...?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267#t=2474.0,2474.0"},{"id":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267/transcript/83654/annotation/100","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Rebecca Rushfield: Louie Finkelstein.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267#t=2474.0,2477.0"},{"id":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267/transcript/83654/annotation/101","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Doria Hughes: Louie. OK. Yeah. She adored him. And I think at first she wasn't so sure. A lot of times she'd be like, \"I don't know if I like this guy.\" But then she got to know him better, and then they showed together. They were on panels. She really, really loved Louie. She thought he was great, and really there was a seriousness there. And just someone...again, shared values. So I think he was really, really important. I think ResIka was also on faculty for some of that time. He had also been on, he was on faculty at Parsons. I think that was part of how she got that teaching gig. So I may be confusing it. It's funny because in her journals, she gets into a lot of the arguments that she has with people. And this is something I've had to explain to my husband. It's a little bit of a Jewish cultural thing, is when we argue with people, that doesn't mean that we don't like them, or... It's an indicator of closeness to a certain extent. And even respect. And her former students often would say, well, it was very loud. I would ask them, what was it like in the art department of Queens in the 1980s, say? \"It was very loud.\" And sometimes there would be like yelling and accusations. And people were a little territorial about their classes. If someone else came in and...\"Those are my students!\" And there was a whole...And I think she was a bit mother hen-ish about her students and protective. And if somebody else came in and started critiquing...","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267#t=2477.0,2589.0"},{"id":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267/transcript/83654/annotation/102","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Rebecca Rushfield: Did she have any involvement with the art history faculty here? Or with the art collection that was there?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267#t=2589.0,2598.0"},{"id":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267/transcript/83654/annotation/103","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Doria Hughes: That's a good question. I know, I'm not sure about whether she was connected in with the art historians. She had a bit of a, despite being very erudite and well-spoken and very intelligent, and well-read, I think she had maybe some insecurities about sort of her being not credentialed enough. In fact, I know that she had that kind of insecurity. She never, other than her degree from Oberlin, she didn't have like a graduate degree in art history. So I think for her, I don't think she felt that she could go toe-to-toe with -- unless it was her brother. No problem there. She'd take on Jimmy anytime: \"You're just my little brother. I'll tell you what is that.\" But I don't think she would tangle with an art history professor.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267#t=2598.0,2652.0"},{"id":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267/transcript/83654/annotation/104","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Rebecca Rushfield: But I wondered if she made any use of the collection with her students, because right now there's the museum, but before that, the art library had the collection of things. So...","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267#t=2652.0,2664.0"},{"id":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267/transcript/83654/annotation/105","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Doria Hughes: That's very likely. I know for a fact that my grandmother studied artworks in reproduction throughout her career. I sort of talk about these art books and things that she had as her Google. That's when I'm trying to talk to younger folks. I'm like, you couldn't just Google an artwork the way you can now. You'd have to find a book and open it up and find, or look at slides. She's always talking about transparencies and slides. And so for her, and a lot of art students at the time, that was how they accessed art. If they couldn't, if it wasn't at the Met, if it wasn't showing at the Frick or these places that she would go to, you'd just have to find a reproduction or a slide. And so she, yeah, that was very much part of her methodology. So I'm sure that she would have made use of that. And I'm sure she would've been showing slides and opening books and things like that with her students. Absolutely.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267#t=2664.0,2727.0"},{"id":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267/transcript/83654/annotation/106","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Doria Hughes: I think she liked to sort of claim certain of the old masters as her teachers, periodically. Like she would write in her journal, \"I'm wild for Cezanne right now.\" Or, \"I'm reading about Matisse or Velazquez.\" I remember as a small child, she just was always, she would pull these books out, open it up. Here's Velazquez or here's Durer. And this is how you do crosshatching. And we'd sit together and draw from these books. And it occurred to me later, oh, she probably did that with her students. That's obviously part of her methodology. So yeah, I know she took them to museums and shows and would walk around. Her students describe what that was like too. \"Look at this painting!\" Very loud and dramatic. Can you imagine walking through the hallowed halls of the Met? [gestures] \"Their lighting is terrible!\" I mean, no filter. Very opinionated.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267#t=2727.0,2792.0"},{"id":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267/transcript/83654/annotation/107","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Rebecca Rushfield: OK. I'm wondering, I guess she taught at Queens and she was involved with the students in the department, but she had no other involvement with the borrough or anything. She came in, she left.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267#t=2792.0,2805.0"},{"id":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267/transcript/83654/annotation/108","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Doria Hughes: Pretty much, yeah. I mean, when she'd be at the school, and she was very involved with the department. She'd be going to departmental meetings. You know, very involved. At one point, in 1976, in her journal, she says, \"Well, I'm the department chair now. \" So she was, it kept her very busy. The other thing was she had a long commute. And I know that because I remember visiting her in 1999, and she had a show, a retrospective show at Queens in that year. And she was like [groaning], \"Oh, do you want to see it?\" And I was like, \"Yeah, I want to see it!\" And she was like, \"OK.\" And we took this trip. I was like, oh my gosh. And it took a while. And we were on the subway, we were on...At the time, I didn't even know. I was like, I'm not from New York and I had not been to Queens, and I was like, \"What are we doing? Where are we going? So this is what we have to do?\" I mean, she was so frugal. She never, didn't own a car, wouldn't have. A taxi? Forget it! Never took a taxi. So it was public transportation the whole way.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267#t=2805.0,2880.0"},{"id":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267/transcript/83654/annotation/109","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Doria Hughes: And she was commenting. She had her sketchbook out. Commenting and drawing. \"Oh, look at this person. Oh, look at that.\" And then we went to the show, and then all the way back. So, I think that was, she just would go and she would be just there and immersed with the students and the crits and the classes and the department, and then the arguments with her colleagues. And then, I mean, that took a huge amount of time. And then back she would go.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267#t=2880.0,2913.0"},{"id":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267/transcript/83654/annotation/110","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Doria Hughes: The other thing to keep in mind is that my grandfather was diagnosed with Parkinson's, early onset Parkinson's, right around the time that she first got hired by, at Queens. And she became his main caregiver. So by the 19-... He was OK in 1970s, and he was doing some part-time teaching throughout that whole time as well. But, by the 1980s, he was in very bad shape. And I remember him, I remember very well. And they were up on this high apartment. And she was still teaching full-time. And I think she had help. There were visiting nurses. And then his last summer, she just was home with him, taking care of him. And that was an enormous source of anxiety for her as the '80s progressed. So yeah, I think it was, well, it was heartbreaking. It was really, it was a very difficult time. So yeah, she was sort of this classic case of this working woman pulled in these different directions. She didn't have to worry about my dad. He had moved to New York. He was married and I was there and all of that. But Robert was a major project for her.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267#t=2913.0,3003.0"},{"id":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267/transcript/83654/annotation/111","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Rebecca Rushfield: You had mentioned sort of the change from abstract to figuration in her work. And I was wondering: At the point when she was at Queens, she was, her work was more figurative.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267#t=3003.0,3014.0"},{"id":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267/transcript/83654/annotation/112","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Doria Hughes: Yes.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267#t=3014.0,3015.0"},{"id":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267/transcript/83654/annotation/113","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Rebecca Rushfield: Did she ever speak...because I always wonder with art teachers, and with music teachers, especially let's say composition.You have a certain aesthetic and vision in your mind, and your students may have a totally different one. How do you? Did she ever talk about that? Like, how do you deal with that?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267#t=3015.0,3034.0"},{"id":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267/transcript/83654/annotation/114","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Doria Hughes: Yeah. So there...she was pretty clear that there was never going to be a \"school of Beck.\" There was never like...all there was, there were values. It was about the values. It was always about finding your own voice and being true to whatever that direction was that you were going to go in an art. And her job, as she saw it, was to instill those values so that a person would have the sort of moral fortitude to endure down whatever path their art was going to take them. And it was about helping people to find that voice. So starting in her centenary year in 2023, I started reaching out to former students of hers and getting stories. And the story that I kept hearing was just, \"Find your way. What is your way? What is your voice?\" No matter what it is. She never tried to influence a student or get them to paint or draw the way she did. She had no interest in that. I think for her, she was like, there's only one person who can make my art and that's me. And that's true for all of her students. And when I look at -- someday, I have a dream of doing a survey show of artwork by her former students.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267#t=3034.0,3118.0"},{"id":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267/transcript/83654/annotation/115","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Rebecca Rushfield: That would be fabulous.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267#t=3118.0,3119.0"},{"id":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267/transcript/83654/annotation/116","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Doria Hughes: I think it would be extraordinary. And the variety is astounding. I mean, certainly she does have students who are figurative artists, but she also has students who are brilliant abstractionists. She has students who do installation art. Of all...I mean, the gamut is just enormous.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267#t=3119.0,3145.0"},{"id":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267/transcript/83654/annotation/117","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Rebecca Rushfield: I'm curious, about how many people consider themselves her students?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267#t=3145.0,3150.0"},{"id":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267/transcript/83654/annotation/118","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Doria Hughes: I am working on a list.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267#t=3150.0,3153.0"},{"id":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267/transcript/83654/annotation/119","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Rebecca Rushfield: Oh, you are organized in all things!","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267#t=3153.0,3156.0"},{"id":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267/transcript/83654/annotation/120","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Doria Hughes: Yes. I have a lot of ongoing projects. I actually just added a new person today that I discovered. This is all...As I go through archives, I sort of comb through and look for references. Because she often references students in her journals or her letters and whatnot. She'll be, \"Oh, I'm really concerned about so-and-so.\" \"Oh, I need to write a recommendation letter.\" I have drafts of her recommendation letters for students. And so I've made it my project; one of my projects is to track down as many of these folks as I can and say, \"Do you remember this teacher?\"","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267#t=3156.0,3197.0"},{"id":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267/transcript/83654/annotation/121","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Doria Hughes: And many of them do. Many of them do. One of the things that came over from her Woodstock days, she and my grandfather met some sort of witchy, interesting person at a bookstore who was into astrology. And that sparked a lifelong hobby, interest in astrology and a recurrence to astrological themes. And my grandmother would draw horoscopes -- she called them horror scopes -- for people just as a fun sort of a hobby kind of a thing. And I will read about different students or people. I'm always looking through, I go on their website and I look on their CV. Did they go to Queens? What years? Who did they list? Oh, Gabriel Laderman. OK. And I start sort of like drilling down, and then I'll maybe find a mention.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267#t=3197.0,3248.0"},{"id":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267/transcript/83654/annotation/122","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Doria Hughes: And I remember sort of hunting down one of these students years ago, and they were talking about, \"Oh, yes, I love to do spirit paintings and this kind of thing, and I had this one teacher who was so encouraging about my interest in astrology.\" And I thought, \"Aha! I know who that is! It can only be my grandmother.\" And it was. And I found the recommendation letter that she wrote for this, and then I contacted her. \"Oh, I remember!\" So yeah. So I found another person today. Another...my grandmother mentioned her in a draft of one letter to another student. I thought, oh, who is that? And I Googled them and I found, oh, Queens BFA, 1970 to '74; Queens College, MFA, 1975 to '76; studied with Gabriel Laderman, Louis Finkelstein, Rosemarie Beck. But also Herbert Aach, Charles Cajori, Gerald Hahn and Richard Miller.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267#t=3248.0,3310.0"},{"id":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267/transcript/83654/annotation/123","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Rebecca Rushfield: Yeah.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267#t=3310.0,3311.0"},{"id":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267/transcript/83654/annotation/124","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Doria Hughes: So there we go. So I just sent out a little note to this person. Do you remember? Maybe? And so we'll see what comes back. So I'm constantly doing this. So I have a database, I'm looking over it now and let's see: [counts names] 1, 2, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17, 18, 19, 20, 22...25, 26, 27, 28, 29, 30... I'm up to around 31 individuals that I've personally reached out to or made contact to. Queens students from...1968 to 1990 are essentially her Queens years.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267#t=3311.0,3352.0"},{"id":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267/transcript/83654/annotation/125","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Rebecca Rushfield: That's very impressive that you have that.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267#t=3352.0,3355.0"},{"id":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267/transcript/83654/annotation/126","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Doria Hughes: It's taken years, and I'm sure this is not a complete list, but I'm working on it. And many of those people are still professional artists and teachers themselves.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267#t=3355.0,3368.0"},{"id":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267/transcript/83654/annotation/127","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Rebecca Rushfield: Do you ever put out little notices in likely places saying, if you were a student of Rosemarie Beck, please contact me?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267#t=3368.0,3377.0"},{"id":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267/transcript/83654/annotation/128","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Doria Hughes: I should do that. I've tended to just make sort of surgical strikes. Social media has been invaluable. And I post on Instagram and in Facebook, and that's actually where, that's the main way that I've found people. Sometimes people will contact me out of the blue, which is wonderful. I just put stuff out there. And I tag her. In 2023, I had sort of this project for her centennial of posting. I called it ...in September I was like, I'm doing this back to school-themed thing where I just post about her students. And so just every week or so, I would post about a different student of hers. And I got some feedback there. And that was really...","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267#t=3377.0,3429.0"},{"id":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267/transcript/83654/annotation/129","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Rebecca Rushfield: Can I ask? The painting behind you?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267#t=3429.0,3432.0"},{"id":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267/transcript/83654/annotation/130","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Doria Hughes: Oh, yes.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267#t=3432.0,3434.0"},{"id":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267/transcript/83654/annotation/131","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Rebecca Rushfield: When in her career is that from?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267#t=3434.0,3437.0"},{"id":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267/transcript/83654/annotation/132","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Doria Hughes: This is an early transitional work. It is part of a still life. This is really when she was still kind of transitioning away from abstraction and towards figuration. It's a still life. It's a little hard to see. There's this...","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267#t=3437.0,3457.0"},{"id":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267/transcript/83654/annotation/133","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Rebecca Rushfield: Right, I see bits behind [you]. And in real life, what size is it, if I can ask?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267#t=3457.0,3465.0"},{"id":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267/transcript/83654/annotation/134","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Doria Hughes: This one is a pretty large painting, and it's a study for an even larger one that was like...one of these was almost 6 feet long.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267#t=3465.0,3475.0"},{"id":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267/transcript/83654/annotation/135","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Rebecca Rushfield: Was that typical for her to do this?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267#t=3475.0,3478.0"},{"id":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267/transcript/83654/annotation/136","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Doria Hughes: No, actually.Though she did do some very large ones. She did, more likely to do vertical things. My husband's 6 feet, so I sort of think of him as sort of my measuring stick for these. But, a lot of times she would work up towards a handful of really large-scale paintings like that. But many of them, like this one, would be studies that would be more like 28 by 32 inches. And then hundreds and hundreds of small sketches. Like 8 1/2 by 14 or 7 by 11. Or 10 by 12. Or things like that. She would do multiple, multiple iterations and variations. Like, OK, let's put, OK, here's the pot here, let's put it over here. Or I'll move it over here in the front. Or put something in the back, or whatever. And it's a little hard to tell, but there's a painted figure behind to give this sort of sense of depth and space. So that wall, we're seeing a bit of an arm and a hand sort of draped. And that's the backdrop. And then in front, there's this still life. That was all part of an astrological series that she called House of Venus. So she would pull in elements that she felt represented, astrologically, elements associated with Venus. The planet Venus. So elements of art and beauty. So there'd be still-life displays and paintings representing some of the great masters or sometimes floral or fruit elements.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267#t=3478.0,3581.0"},{"id":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267/transcript/83654/annotation/137","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Rebecca Rushfield: Can I ask? Once she retired from Queens College, what did she do, besides paint, then?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267#t=3581.0,3588.0"},{"id":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267/transcript/83654/annotation/138","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Doria Hughes: Yeah. Well, her retirement from Queens pretty much came in the wake of my grandfather's passing. He died later in the year in 1989, and she was still going. And she started the fall semester, and she just kept teaching, but it was incredibly painful and difficult. And finally, she retired in 1990 from Queens at that point. And I think she was still just in tremendous grief and loss at that point. And I think the year of 1990 was just...I think she felt adrift. And then she had a couple of friends who said -- well, one, they were from Washington DC and the husband was a classical...He was a classicist. He studied ancient Greek, Sophocles. The ancient Greek dramas and theater and literature and that kind of thing. He said, \"We're going to Greece. Would you like to come with us?\"","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267#t=3588.0,3656.0"},{"id":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267/transcript/83654/annotation/139","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Doria Hughes: And she thought, oh, that's an opportunity. And she went. And that helped bring her back. She had started working on the theme of Antigone, which is a great tragedy, and it's about loss and love and family and all of these things that are, I think, her way of processing those last years of illness in my grandfather's life and beyond. And so then going to Greece and then seeing the great theaters where these plays were put on...A lot of that was, I think that was getting in touch -- as I realize now -- with her own theater background too, to help sustain her. And she came back kind of renewed. And she realized that her life wasn't over, and she had a lot more painting in her.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267#t=3656.0,3713.0"},{"id":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267/transcript/83654/annotation/140","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Rebecca Rushfield: She was comparatively young when he died.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267#t=3713.0,3716.0"},{"id":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267/transcript/83654/annotation/141","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Doria Hughes: Yeah. She was around 68 or 69, yeah. And I think she sort of thought about this and thought about what she wanted. And she was actively being recruited and had been actively recruited for some time by Mercedes Matter at the New York Studio School.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267#t=3716.0,3744.0"},{"id":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267/transcript/83654/annotation/142","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Doria Hughes: And Mercedes was...My grandmother was like, \"Oh, that opportunist, Mercedes.\" Mercedes had been angling in on my grandmother for years. And I have a letter of hers that she wrote, because my grandmother would occasionally go to the Studio School and present, or do a little this or that. And Mercedes is writing her, \"Oh, we loved you. It was wonderful. If we could have a little more of you. I know you're at Queens, but we would love to have...\" She was very, very loyal, and she was part of this community at Queens. And then came all of this. Everything that happened and then her own trauma. And Mercedes just swooped right in and scooped her up.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267#t=3744.0,3787.0"},{"id":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267/transcript/83654/annotation/143","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Doria Hughes: \"You don't have to have the commute!\" Because the Studio School is right around the corner from where she lived. And Becky was a grieving widow. She was lonely. She was lost. And there, here's this little local community of artists. Like, \"Oh, we need you.\" And she went back to teaching and ended up squabbling with Mercedes. They tried co-teaching. It was a disaster! It was like legendary. I attended a kind of a panel conference a few months ago on the subject of Mercedes and my grandmother at the Studio School, because the echoes of that were still rippling.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267#t=3787.0,3834.0"},{"id":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267/transcript/83654/annotation/144","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Rebecca Rushfield: Really?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267#t=3834.0,3835.0"},{"id":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267/transcript/83654/annotation/145","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Doria Hughes: Yes. Huge drama. Big drama. And then, of course, it ended when Mercedes herself fell terribly ill, and it turns out had no money and had nothing left from the school. And then my grandmother said, \"We have to help Mercedes.\" And went around bothering everyone. \"We need to get money!\" Bothering former students. You know, \"Buy one of her paintings. She needs money. She needs care.\" That was always the way with her, very loyal. She would argue, and she would fight and everything, but if that person, God forbid if anything happened to them, she would be there at their side to help out.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267#t=3835.0,3874.0"},{"id":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267/transcript/83654/annotation/146","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Rebecca Rushfield: I see you have your grandmother's theatrics.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267#t=3874.0,3878.0"},{"id":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267/transcript/83654/annotation/147","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Doria Hughes: A bit. I'm actually a performing artist by trade. That's my vocation. And I always had a bit of a sense of the dramatic, and she was always very much a role model for me. And I didn't realize, really, until a lot later how much that theater role, theater and narrative, were so, so core.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267#t=3878.0,3901.0"},{"id":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267/transcript/83654/annotation/148","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Rebecca Rushfield: Can I ask? As a girl growing up, did you know that she was a well-known, respected artist, or she was your grandmother who painted and drew?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267#t=3901.0,3912.0"},{"id":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267/transcript/83654/annotation/149","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Doria Hughes: I think for me, she was first and foremost, my grandmother and I loved just being around the art. And I liked to draw with her. That was something that she never could do with her own child, because my father has zero aptitude for art. Very, very smart guy. But this is like, he's color blind, and he has like no aptitude for drawing whatsoever. He has a nice eye and he knows a ton about everything. But when I came along -- I can draw a little -- and she was like, \"Oh!\" She was so excited.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267#t=3912.0,3953.0"},{"id":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267/transcript/83654/annotation/150","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Doria Hughes: But what really, what drew me always to her art was the narrative content. And that's what I would ask her about. We'd have these whole long questions and everything: Well, what is this painting? In the '80s, when she was at Queens, she was working on Ovid's Metamorphoses. She was doing a whole series drawn from specific tales from the Metamorphoses. And so I would see these figures. Sketches and things all across the breakfast table. What's that? Well, that's Apollo and Daphne. And she would tell me the whole story. Oh my God, this was amazing. So she started sending me books for Christmas and my birthday on Greek mythology. So this ended up becoming my lifelong passion, is folklore and narrative, and the performance of traditional tales. So that is actually what I do. I am a professional storyteller. And that is my lifelong passion and vocation.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267#t=3953.0,4017.0"},{"id":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267/transcript/83654/annotation/151","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Rebecca Rushfield: Before I let you go, I am curious -- is the foundation planning any exhibits coming up? And would you ever exhibit her embroideries with her paintings, or...?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267#t=4017.0,4031.0"},{"id":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267/transcript/83654/annotation/152","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Doria Hughes: That has been done. Since she passed, actually, it's become in the 21st century, most shows of her work will include her embroideries. That's sort of a bit of an irony. People will sometimes say, would your grandmother have approved of that? Maybe, maybe not. I think she'd be a little...But it's a very different audience now. And understanding.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267#t=4031.0,4054.0"},{"id":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267/transcript/83654/annotation/153","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Rebecca Rushfield: It's a different time, and craft is respected.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267#t=4054.0,4057.0"},{"id":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267/transcript/83654/annotation/154","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Doria Hughes: Yes. Right. In a way that I don't think she experienced in the 20th century. And she was very much a woman of the 20th century. That was her mindset. That's where she was raised. That's where sort of her foundation, all of that came from. So that was her view through the world. Yeah.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267#t=4057.0,4080.0"},{"id":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267/transcript/83654/annotation/155","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Rebecca Rushfield: Well, thank you. It's been wonderful speaking with you, and this has been such fun.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267#t=4080.0,4084.0"},{"id":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267/transcript/83654/annotation/156","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Doria Hughes: Well, I love it.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267#t=4084.0,4086.0"},{"id":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267/transcript/83654/annotation/157","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Rebecca Rushfield: You're such a storyteller, I didn't really have to ask any questions. You just...","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267#t=4086.0,4092.0"},{"id":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267/transcript/83654/annotation/158","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Doria Hughes: Well, this is what I do. And I do online presentations and in-person presentations at schools and other places. I love doing that. That's a ton of fun. I have a whole bunch of webinars and things that I do on her. And I usually go with a narrative theme, in part because she was a narrative painter, but also because that's my predilection.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267#t=4092.0,4113.0"},{"id":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267/transcript/83654/annotation/159","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Rebecca Rushfield: Right, thank you. So when the interview is transcribed -- which there's a backlog -- so after that, I'll look at it first and try and correct any spellings of things that the transcribers got incorrectly. And then we'll send it to you for the more, correction of facts, and if you want to put in notes or other parentheses, you can do that. Well, this has been great. And actually it'll go online as part of the Queens Memory program of the Queens Public Library system, so people are able to access it and hear about your grandmother.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267#t=4113.0,4157.0"},{"id":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267/transcript/83654/annotation/160","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Doria Hughes: Oh, that's wonderful. And I'll be delighted to share that link, of course.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267#t=4157.0,4161.0"},{"id":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267/transcript/83654/annotation/161","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Rebecca Rushfield: OK, great.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267#t=4161.0,4162.0"},{"id":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267/transcript/83654/annotation/162","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Doria Hughes: Great. Yeah. Oh, and you had asked about shows. We regularly do shows from our collection in our gallery space, which is in lower Manhattan. In the site -- we have basically, it's a historic building where her final painting studio exists, that we maintain. So people can visit that. You can schedule visits, and that's also the collection space. And there's a gallery, and we'll often have shows there. And then all of those shows are digitized and archived for viewing. So yeah, on our website you can click and there's a whole thing. It's like a virtual viewing room. We just have one that went up recently on the Tempest from the 1970s.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267#t=4162.0,4203.0"},{"id":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267/transcript/83654/annotation/163","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Rebecca Rushfield: Great. Alright. Wonderful, wonderful. Thank you. Bye-bye. I'm going to end now. Alright, bye.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267#t=4203.0,4216.0"},{"id":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267/transcript/83654/annotation/164","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Doria Hughes: Take care.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://queenslibrary.aviaryplatform.com/collections/150/collection_resources/159335/file/290267#t=4216.0,4216.992"}]}]}]}